Disaster: Floors. What would you do?

[Meagan]

So, we closed today! !!!!!!!! :loveit: :loveit: :loveit: :loveit: :loveit: :loveit: :loveit: :loveit: OMG I have wanted to be a homeowner so long!

So the first and I mean VERY FIRST thing we did is run to the house with a hammer and crowbar and start tearing up floors.

ANNNND...

In the dining room, it goes like this:

peel and stick vinyl (but somebody put a bunch of glue on there just for good measure)
over
sheet vinyl
over
subfloor
over some thin layer we can't quite make out, either sheet vinyl or linoleum...

and under all that,

TWO hardwood floors. But try as we might we could not get to them, because of the subfloor. Also the rooms do not all have equal numbers of layers, yet all the rooms are on the same level...weird.

So we started feeling like, well, what's the point of ripping up all the way down to the hardwood when it might be beyond salvage...particularly since there are TWO hardwood floors, stacked right on top of each other. It's not as though we'd be accessing the actual original wood floor unless we tore up wood floor #2 and why would anyone have put down Wood floor #2 right on top of wood floor #1 unless there was something really wrong with it?

Then we began wondering if we might be better off just buying new flooring. We don't have the budget for it right this minute, but in 6 mo - a year, we will have a chunk of cash coming in, so maybe we could pull it off.

So we went to Lowe's to get a general idea of prices. Most of the floors were way beyond our reach price-wise, but there were a few options we could afford (within the next year) and liked, and we also liked bamboo quite a bit. While we were there we looked at laminates and were sorely tempted by the price and durability. However, every laminate floor I've ever seen "in real life" has been so shiny and so "perfect" in its grain consistency that it has just looked fake-y. I know that's probably not the case with ALL laminates, but the ones I've seen have been pretty glaring. UNLESS OF COURSE I have seen laminates that I never recognized as such because they were so good?

Anyway we were discussing what to do about the floors and decided to run by the Habitat for Humanity store to see what they had, and lo and behold: they had a HUGE pallet of laminate flooring, for 80cents a square foot!

Well, at that price we could afford to redo the entire first floor, like, tomorrow. So again, sorely tempted. But we decided to sleep on it. We looked at some other options when we got home, like bamboo, but even the cheapest bamboo was around $3.50 a square foot.

So I think the question becomes: do we go with a quick fix and commit to it for 2-5 years until we can afford the wood flooring I would REALLY like, or do we live with what we have for now, for 6 months or so, and get some relatively inexpensive wood floor that may not be our first choice?

I realize that ripping everything up may still be an option, but we're a little worried about the fact that all the floors are built up differently and yet are all level. I'm wondering if maybe that was done purposely to even out the floors? Also, we have no idea if what we find will be useable at all, and it could still cost us lots of money to have it sanded and refinished, and we still might not be happy with the results. So...we're leaning toward a new floor.

I admit I have always been a bit biased against laminate because of the laminates I've had experience with, but it could be a potentially perfect quick fix for our temporary problem, and we could always re-think it later as budget allows. And who knows...maybe I'd love it.

Thoughts?

[mowse]

Well, one thing to consider when thinking about ripping floors...ASBESTOS. Yeah. We have lovely hardwood floors in our house, but at some point, someone put down asbestos linoleum in the kitchen and that isnt coming up without serious HAZMAT.

We put down no glue vinyl flooring in the kitchen and it looks really nice. It was very inexpensive and you can roll it up and swap it out. I think we paid less than $1/sq ft and the installation effort was minimal. If that's something you might want to consider as a temporary solution til you figure out what you want to do.

[Meagan]

Well, one thing to consider when thinking about ripping floors...ASBESTOS. Yeah. We have lovely hardwood floors in our house, but at some point, someone put down asbestos linoleum in the kitchen and that isnt coming up without serious HAZMAT.

We put down no glue vinyl flooring in the kitchen and it looks really nice. It was very inexpensive and you can roll it up and swap it out. I think we paid less than $1/sq ft and the installation effort was minimal. If that's something you might want to consider as a temporary solution til you figure out what you want to do.

Good idea, too. I think the fact that we could get the laminate SO cheap is what's drawing us to it. I'd rather do that than vinyl especially at 80 cents a square foot, yk?

[Tracy]

I think I'd go with the laminate you found for 80 cents and save for what you really want in a few years.(nt)

[kellydog]

I would go with the laminate at that price. It might not be what you want, but it will be functional and easy to care for until you can getexactly what you want.

[mudcreekmama]

I HATE laminate flooring, we have it in our basement along with tile and I hate everything about it. It is not that durable, it is a pita if it gets wet, and it feels GROSS underfoot.

BUT Ikea has a relatively inexpensive engineered wood flooring that feels good underfoot and is easier to clean. I liked it when i had it.


Personally I'd do what people do here in the maritimes with floors that are not up to snuff - paint them until I could afford the flooring I wanted.

[Meagan]

I HATE laminate flooring, we have it in our basement along with tile and I hate everything about it. It is not that durable, it is a pita if it gets wet, and it feels GROSS underfoot.


Really? See, everybody I've spoken to raves about how it's indestructible. People with big dogs running around on it all day and not leaving a mark, etc.

We had some in our basement a couple houses ago and the floors weren't totally even, and the edges of the laminate started to bend which made the "plastic" surface much more obvious. But the floors had been in at least 6-7 years by that point, so I figured it was an age thing.

Good to know about IKEA. Man, is there anything IKEA *doesn't* do?

[Storymama]

I think laminate REALLY varies, and you should try to find a local friend with some installed to go walk around on in your bare feet, and feel with your hands. Try to find someone who loves it, and someone who hates it, and compare - then decide if the stuff you could buy is the "good" stuff or the "bad" stuff. (Maybe read some customer reviews online too - see if Amazon sells it, so you can check the brand available at ReStore.)

I think subflooring is not a huge deal to reinstall - isn't it just plywood sheets, nailed in place? I would myself really want to see those wood floors below, and try to restore them. It's the bones of the house, and I like contact with that.

Costco has flooring, too - including bamboo.

[BlueMama]

omgosh that was fast!!! ~*~CONGRATULATIONS!~*~

I'd go with the HFH laminate, deal with other stuff that comes up (and other stuff *will* come up - it's all part of being a homeowner, sigh) and revisit the floors in your <5-year timeframe.

Congratulations!!!!!!!!

[lunita]

I don't remember the details, but when we got our vinyl we considered laminate and it was going to be expensive to install... not because of materials cost, but because the manufacturer didn't recommend installing it over a certain number of other layers. We could put vinyl over our old vinyl but we would have had to cut out the old vinyl and lay a new subfloor to properly install the laminate??

Anyone know what I'm talking about or am I just imagining this?

Just found something on Armstrong floors.com that says that it can be installed on anything less than 1/4 inch thick.

Also, check the AC rating of the stuff at the ReStore as part of your decision making process. http://www.laminateflooringco.com/a-laminate-ac-ratings.html It should be on the pallet somewhere, and I wouldn't put AC1 all over your first floor, even if it is dirt cheap.

ETA: I think the thing was we were going to need to cut out the floors anyway?? So we weren't really going to be able to to a DIY laminate and decided we liked the vinyl better? DH would probably remember better.

[Chryse]

TWO hardwood floors. But try as we might we could not get to them, because of the subfloor. Also the rooms do not all have equal numbers of layers, yet all the rooms are on the same level...weird.

So we started feeling like, well, what's the point of ripping up all the way down to the hardwood when it might be beyond salvage...particularly since there are TWO hardwood floors, stacked right on top of each other. It's not as though we'd be accessing the actual original wood floor unless we tore up wood floor #2 and why would anyone have put down Wood floor #2 right on top of wood floor #1 unless there was something really wrong with it?



When we did the inspection on our home, like you, we discovered our floor was a second layer of hardwood, directly over the first. We too, figured there must have been something really wrong with the floor that they put hardwood directly over an old hardwood floor. Like upstairs, where the wood is in bad shape, with huge charred spots from the old wood stoves. The linoleum was so badly ripped that I ripped it out, cleaned up the wood as best I could, then painted directly over it. (It had originally been painted mustard yellow, apparently.:dunno: )

This is when I would ask for professional advice. See what it would cost to rip up the subfloor and refinish the hardwood underneath. Then compare that to buying the cheaper laminate. If it is very expensive, I would buy the cheaper laminate, and save up for what you really want in a few years time. Better than spending all the money you will have available in a year, on something that is less than what you really want.

[Rosemary]

I agree, I'd go with the laminate. You may end up liking it. I do not hate laminiate, I actually like some of it, but I know what you mean about the shininess factor. It is not all like that in my experience though.

For the price, I'd go with that for now.

I think I'd go with the laminate you found for 80 cents and save for what you really want in a few years.(nt)

[tumblewieds]

I would go with the laminate at that price. It might not be what you want, but it will be functional and easy to care for until you can getexactly what you want.


I totally agree.

[Kim]

yes, I think I would ask a pro first. We've redone flooring in our home but that many layers and materials and possible hazards would make me be cautious right now. NT

[riversprite]

I HATE laminate flooring, we have it in our basement along with tile and I hate everything about it. It is not that durable, it is a pita if it gets wet, and it feels GROSS underfoot.

BUT Ikea has a relatively inexpensive engineered wood flooring that feels good underfoot and is easier to clean. I liked it when i had it.


Personally I'd do what people do here in the maritimes with floors that are not up to snuff - paint them until I could afford the flooring I wanted.

LOL! That's what we're doing with our stairs that run from the main floor to the upstairs. We've ripped up the carpet and are just going to paint it until we can afford something else. :-)

[Brenda]

Well, one thing to consider when thinking about ripping floors...ASBESTOS. Yeah. We have lovely hardwood floors in our house, but at some point, someone put down asbestos linoleum in the kitchen and that isnt coming up without serious HAZMAT.

We put down no glue vinyl flooring in the kitchen and it looks really nice. It was very inexpensive and you can roll it up and swap it out. I think we paid less than $1/sq ft and the installation effort was minimal. If that's something you might want to consider as a temporary solution til you figure out what you want to do.

Real linoleum does not and never has had asbestos. Sheet vinyl backed w/ asbestos and vinyl asbestos tiles were put down up until sometime in the '70s or '80s, but lineloeum doesn't have it. Picky detail, I know, but there is a huge difference in the substances.

Meagan, I'd say get this tested and know what you are a dealing with regards to substances. The tests usually a reasonable price, and then you know for sure. Your department of health or university extension office could probably give you some resources for that.

As for laminate, I'm with dirt on that. I don't like the look or the feel.

[Hawthorne]

Real linoleum does not and never has had asbestos. Sheet vinyl backed w/ asbestos and vinyl asbestos tiles were put down up until sometime in the '70s or '80s, but lineloeum doesn't have it. Picky detail, I know, but there is a huge difference in the substances.

Meagan, I'd say get this tested and know what you are a dealing with regards to substances. The tests usually a reasonable price, and then you know for sure. Your department of health or university extension office could probably give you some resources for that.

As for laminate, I'm with dirt on that. I don't like the look or the feel.

:iagree:

[leannan_si]

We had some water spill on ours in one spot, IIRC I think it was a sippy or a water bottle or something that dripped slowly, and it warped. The better quality floors are supposed to be more resistant to this, but I'm pretty sure that it's still standard warning to be really, really careful with liquids and laminates.


I HATE laminate flooring, we have it in our basement along with tile and I hate everything about it. It is not that durable, it is a pita if it gets wet, and it feels GROSS underfoot.

BUT Ikea has a relatively inexpensive engineered wood flooring that feels good underfoot and is easier to clean. I liked it when i had it.


Personally I'd do what people do here in the maritimes with floors that are not up to snuff - paint them until I could afford the flooring I wanted.

[Bonny]

and it's really not that shiney when it's dirty, dusty and has kid stuff all over it. Just saying.

[sarahrose]

I agree. I have laminate in many places in my house (upstairs in my hall, den and bedroom) and downstairs in part of my living/ dining room and my kitchen. The only place I hate it is in my kitchen (because I didn't pick out the color and it just isn't something I'd put down in my kitchen). Really I'd love quality hardwood but frankly, that's more than we can afford. Plus I have 2 very active little boys and I like how easy it is to clean.

[mudcreekmama]

and it's really not that shiney when it's dirty, dusty and has kid stuff all over it. Just saying.

The stuff in our basement isn't shiny either (it has a slight grain texture and a semi gloss finish) but there is no way to repair where it has warped and it does it wherever a spill happens on a seam - and fairly quickly. So if I didn't see a kid spill water, juice whatever, or the dog has an accident it's warped if i don't get to it within the hour or so. But I find that cleaning it is a pain too, it looks steaky and it feels sticky underfoot which really grosses me out. And it makes a wierd sticky sound when you walk over it in bare feet - the dog and cats too. It creeps me out.

[mudcreekmama]

LOL! That's what we're doing with our stairs that run from the main floor to the upstairs. We've ripped up the carpet and are just going to paint it until we can afford something else. :-)

They do really cool things here when they paint their stairs - the steps one colour the backs another then funky stencilling on the backs or freehand folk art, sometimes sayings with letter stencils or freehand - bad spelling and all - or they paint everything one colour then do a painted runner down the middle. If we move into a place where that's an issue (stairs we need to refinish that's what I'll do - a striped painted runner down the middle of the stairs. Its traditional here to do the downstairs floors with hardwood and softwood upstairs, then to paint the softwood - usually really bright colours! I love the look. There are often whole steps up and down between additions on houses here too. They would add on a room at a time all higgily piggily as their family expanded and they had a bit of extra money. The basements in these houses are sometimes really nightmarish - stone foundations that look like people were walled up in them because a new section might only be an 8x8 room!

[riversprite]

They do really cool things here when they paint their stairs - the steps one colour the backs another then funky stencilling on the backs or freehand folk art, sometimes sayings with letter stencils or freehand - bad spelling and all - or they paint everything one colour then do a painted runner down the middle. If we move into a place where that's an issue (stairs we need to refinish that's what I'll do - a striped painted runner down the middle of the stairs. Its traditional here to do the downstairs floors with hardwood and softwood upstairs, then to paint the softwood - usually really bright colours! I love the look. There are often whole steps up and down between additions on houses here too. They would add on a room at a time all higgily piggily as their family expanded and they had a bit of extra money. The basements in these houses are sometimes really nightmarish - stone foundations that look like people were walled up in them because a new section might only be an 8x8 room!

Interesting! We have hardwood all throughout the main floor and carpeting upstairs that we have plans of ripping up, but haven't decided what to do with that floor. *I* woud love painted softwood!!
We do need to bear in mind that we intend to move at some point (do you really see us fitting into this neighbourhood permanently? It's a great starter home, but not our style!) Selling a more interesting house might be hard. LOL!
Our plan was indeed to paint the steps one colour and then the backs another, but I like your "runner" idea!
We were just talking about it this week, because we ripped it up many months ago and it's just been sitting there looking terrible ever since!

[Hawthorne]

Just be warned that if you have soft wood flooring upstairs that has been carpeted over, it may be because it is splintering. Our upstairs floors are absolutely horrible, and our bedroom floor. Everywhere with this type of wood (pine?) is a wreck. I wish we could put hardwood upstairs, but it will likely be carpeted some day in the distant future.

[riversprite]

Just be warned that if you have soft wood flooring upstairs that has been carpeted over, it may be because it is splintering. Our upstairs floors are absolutely horrible, and our bedroom floor. Everywhere with this type of wood (pine?) is a wreck. I wish we could put hardwood upstairs, but it will likely be carpeted some day in the distant future.

My guess is actually that there is NOTHING worth having under the carpet upstairs. It was carpetted when the house was built. I think we'll have to start fresh when we finally rip it up. We can't afford to do hardwood up there, I don't think.
I do NOT like the idea of splintering, though! Yikes! (I have an almost phobia about splinters!)

[mudcreekmama]

My guess is actually that there is NOTHING worth having under the carpet upstairs. It was carpetted when the house was built. I think we'll have to start fresh when we finally rip it up. We can't afford to do hardwood up there, I don't think.
I do NOT like the idea of splintering, though! Yikes! (I have an almost phobia about splinters!)

Thats why people painted them, it makes the softwood much more durable.

[Hawthorne]

My guess is actually that there is NOTHING worth having under the carpet upstairs. It was carpetted when the house was built. I think we'll have to start fresh when we finally rip it up. We can't afford to do hardwood up there, I don't think.
I do NOT like the idea of splintering, though! Yikes! (I have an almost phobia about splinters!)

Yeah, so do some of the kids that come to visit us! :( I have throw rugs in the worse places, but I hate them because they're hard to vacuum around.

[Meagan]

I am knee-deep in boxes over here but wanted to pop in now that I've got internet again to update: some very motivated family members and friends tore through five layers of flooring and subflooring on Saturday and unveiled...glossy wood floors. :loveit: :loveit: The biggest problem is that the vinyl was stapled AND nailed to the wood so now there are uniform nail holes throughout, but they are small and not that noticeable from standing height. We're hoping that some wood touch-up and maybe a new coat of polyurethane will do the trick (With five kids I'd really rather not have the pressure of keeping up "perfect" floors anyway).

[Bonny]

woohoo! that is so cool!

[Hawthorne]

wow, that's amazing! Why do people do that stuff anyway? I can't imagine covering up nice hardwood floors.

[lunita]

YAy!!!

The holes from our carpet tack strips pretty much disappeared when we had our floors refinished. The only thing left anywhere are a few stains from where water caused the metal to rust.

[Rosemary]

Ditto about the holes here. Good job!
YAy!!!

The holes from our carpet tack strips pretty much disappeared when we had our floors refinished. The only thing left anywhere are a few stains from where water caused the metal to rust.

[threecubs]

Yay!!

[macaquinha]

I am knee-deep in boxes over here but wanted to pop in now that I've got internet again to update: some very motivated family members and friends tore through five layers of flooring and subflooring on Saturday and unveiled...glossy wood floors. :loveit: :loveit: The biggest problem is that the vinyl was stapled AND nailed to the wood so now there are uniform nail holes throughout, but they are small and not that noticeable from standing height. We're hoping that some wood touch-up and maybe a new coat of polyurethane will do the trick (With five kids I'd really rather not have the pressure of keeping up "perfect" floors anyway).

Yay!!! Nail holes just make it look 'distressed' which is very chic, don't ya know.... We have nail holes and holes filled with old cork (seriously, wine bottle cork!), and lots of other weirdness in our floors. We like it that way. :-P

(And not to one-up you or anything, but our vinyl floor was nailed and stapled and laid over a layer of tar paper, so the wood was all tarry and sticky, too! The floor dude went through a lot of sandpaper on that section.)