Parents giving parenting advice....

[Hobbes]

Ok, before I tell you my story. Give me an honest and frank assessment of this breakfast DD ate the other day:

1/2 cup of oatmeal
1 1/2-2 tsp of peanut butter
1 whole smashed banana

(all of that mixed together)

with, on the side,
5 huge strawberries sprinkled with barely a 1/2 tsp (if that) of powdered sugar
Raspberry tea mixed with unsweetened lemonade with a tsp of sugar.

These is DD's favorite breakfast

[indigo]

Sounds gross (because I hate pb) but very healthful and substantial. I'd love for my kids to eat that in the morning!

[Spark]

Sounds delicious to me. Portions appropriate, whole foods, etc. Unless you cooked the oats in corn syrup and gasoline, I really cannot see a problem. ;)

[Ali]

Well, from a mom who serves poptarts, I can't imagine who could find fault with this. Or why.

Did someone think it was to much to serve to a little girl? Worried you are making her fat {eye roll} or something????

[gfrach]

It's interesting how different people have different ideas of what is appropriate food-wise, isn't it? No one here likes oatmeal, but really that sounds like a decent breakfast. I personally would try for more protein in it, but that's because I know that C and I need our protein, esp in the morning.

[laurata]

Sounds like a very healthful and tasty breakfast.

[Meagan]

Sounds like a great breakfast to me. I'd be grossed out by the mixing it all together, but kids do gross stuff like that :)

[Tangwystl]

Ok, before I tell you my story. Give me an honest and frank assessment of this breakfast DD ate the other day:

1/2 cup of oatmeal
1 1/2-2 tsp of peanut butter
1 whole smashed banana

(all of that mixed together)

with, on the side,
5 huge strawberries sprinkled with barely a 1/2 tsp (if that) of powdered sugar
Raspberry tea mixed with unsweetened lemonade with a tsp of sugar.

These is DD's favorite breakfast

Sounds good to me! I don't do juice of any kind but I do let Muriel have a bit of sugar on her oatmeal so I don't think that sounds off.

[jerzymama]

Sounds like a deconstructed low fat oatmeal peanut butter muffin (banana replaces fat in muffin recipes) with fruit on the side.

What's the problem?

Is anyone giving you shit about sugar????? That's crazy talk. There's *nothing* wrong with sugar as a condiment. It's when it's being consumed as a food group that there's an issue.


Ok, before I tell you my story. Give me an honest and frank assessment of this breakfast DD ate the other day:

1/2 cup of oatmeal
1 1/2-2 tsp of peanut butter
1 whole smashed banana

(all of that mixed together)

with, on the side,
5 huge strawberries sprinkled with barely a 1/2 tsp (if that) of powdered sugar
Raspberry tea mixed with unsweetened lemonade with a tsp of sugar.

These is DD's favorite breakfast

[candeo]

Sounds like a great breakfast. I'm trying really hard to come up with a criticism of it but I can't. Unless she's really hungry an hour or two later, in which case I'd say maybe she needs more protein. I don't think that's the right tree to be barking up, though, is it?

Let's see. T has a friend whose father won't let him have one molecule of refined sugar, so he'd probably criticize that aspect of it. But I wouldn't.

[Sarah]

Well, from a mom who serves poptarts, I can't imagine who could find fault with this. Or why.

Did someone think it was to much to serve to a little girl? Worried you are making her fat {eye roll} or something????

This is me, too. That sounds AMAZING. Claire usually has an egg an toast, or an english muffin with cheese. Angus is all about the poptarts. Yes, I have shame. I'd much rather they ate like E.

[Hobbes]

Ok, before I tell you my story. Give me an honest and frank assessment of this breakfast DD ate the other day:

1/2 cup of oatmeal
1 1/2-2 tsp of peanut butter
1 whole smashed banana

(all of that mixed together)

with, on the side,
5 huge strawberries sprinkled with barely a 1/2 tsp (if that) of powdered sugar
Raspberry tea mixed with unsweetened lemonade with a tsp of sugar.

These is DD's favorite breakfast

It's my mother. ARGH.

So, we were at her house. I was making DD breakfast. I usually also mix a bit of yogurt in there (which will really gross out those who hate all that mixing), but they didn't have plain yogurt).

My mother immediately said: "Is that healthy?"
I looked a bit incredulous, because I thought it was quite healthy.
"I mean," she interjected, "that has a lot of fat and you are adding sugar."

I just looked at here with a puzzled look and let it go. I mean, this is the mother who fed my daughter fruit loops the last time or who fed us captain crunch or the like when we were kids.

(it was HERB tea and lemon juice mixed with water for goodness sake)

So I sent an email her later. I know _exactly_ what I feed her because I am a bit OCD about breakfast. I did the calculations.
It was 13 grams of protein, she needs 30 in a day... on target.
It was 10 grams of fiber, 15-20 grams for child her age... on target
It was 7 grams of fat, she should get less than 70, more than 50, no more than 20 saturated. On target.
It was 1.5 tsps of added sugar, recommended no more than 7-8/day. On target.
It was nearly 200% of the vitamin C, beyond target.
11% of the iron
6% of the calcium
>100% of the potassium
4% of vitamin A

I wrote her this and that it was a perfectly healthy breakfast, in fact about as healthy as she could eat barring adding maybe a bit of yogurt (which we do sometimes) or a bit more fruit. The stuff that was low (vitamin A, iron, etc) she'd be getting more of at lunch and dinner of course.

Her response: I still think it was not healthy.

WTF? Some people have opinions in spite of facts.

I would have just let it go, except earlier in the week we were having dinner and my Mom turned to me and said:

"You really need to do something about E's loudness. She yells too much"
Earlier at our home Emma came in the house yelling exuberantly about something and my mother said "I wish she'd stop screaming" so apparently this was a bee in her bonnet that night.
I responded to her that we know, and we are dealing with it (we do know and we are. We discuss indoor voice, we don't raise our own voices, we don't respond). The thing is, that evening at home and outside her 'loudness' was all excitement. THere was no yelling AT anyone, or anger. It was all joy and exuberance. Which is E. I guess I'm a bit more tolerant of that than my mother.

She didn't let it drop there and decided I required parenting advice. She continued with:
"Really, you really should. It's rude and people will not want to be around her. It will make her life harder... blah blah blah"
(really, blah blah blah. She just kept going on and on about it and how bad it was and how we needed to do something about it.). I tried to change the subject, but she continued. I said "We're working on it Mom."

Wouldn't you get the hint? "I got it, now you can stop talking about it" ..

She didn't, because then she put her hand on my arm and said "You know, when she's with us she's never like that. It was the same with your brother's kids."

Argh. So, my mother's magical parenting skills were able to quiet E down apparently.

I turned to her and said
"Mom, children are more often than not much more polite and quiet when they are not around people they are comfortable with like their parents."

I didn't mean it as an insult (I mean, she is more comfortable around us than them, but she loves them), but that kids tend to be much better when they are not with their parents (they know our buttons and they are comfortable around us). But she took it as such, because she immediately quieted down.

Of course, then the breakfast thing.

PLEASE OH PLEASE God, Karma Bank or YAAPS women... keep me on track to NOT GIVE MY DD PARENTING ADVICE when she's a parent?!?! Please don't make me my mother.

[Hawthorne]

Uhhhhh..... yeah. I'm not sure I would be calm in that situation.
The breakfast was fine, btw. My kids eat cereal (Honey Bunches or- the ONLY freaking cereal Lewis will eat is the Reese's Peanut Butter one) w/ whole milk, or they eat eggs w/ shredded Cheddar (if I can talk them into it), end of story. Sometimes there is juice. If you get the opportunity, perhaps tell her how many good parents who know who feed their children CRAP. LOL

[elsie]

that is like breakfast of champions! I am such a stickler for nutrition, but even Abel eats cereal w/ milk every morning and that's it cos I refuse to cook on a school morning.

My mother and my dh do this same thing, arguing against the facts with opinions and things they believe from childhood, old wives tales and such. I just try not to listen and make sure I know I know what I am talking about.

[elizabeth]

I think that's the point where I would just say "Uh huh, uh huh, could you pass the bean dip?" I won't let stuff like that push my buttons and I wouldn't try to prove I was right, and I totally reserve the right to be an interfering grandma with my own incorrect and biased opinions on what my children are doing incorrectly.

[anastasia]

Ok, before I tell you my story. Give me an honest and frank assessment of this breakfast DD ate the other day:

1/2 cup of oatmeal
1 1/2-2 tsp of peanut butter
1 whole smashed banana

(all of that mixed together)

with, on the side,
5 huge strawberries sprinkled with barely a 1/2 tsp (if that) of powdered sugar
Raspberry tea mixed with unsweetened lemonade with a tsp of sugar.

These is DD's favorite breakfast

That sounds awesome to me. What does your mom think IS a healthy breakfast?

[sarahs]

My mother still pulls crap like that. But I have gotten pretty good at just inwardly rolling my eyes and moving on. It helps that I catch my kids rolling their eyes at her too. How awful is it that? :-P

[Amanda_Reyasmom]

That would be my question!
That sounds awesome to me. What does your mom think IS a healthy breakfast?

[Hobbes]

My mother still pulls crap like that. But I have gotten pretty good at just inwardly rolling my eyes and moving on. It helps that I catch my kids rolling their eyes at her too. How awful is it that? :-P

lol :D

[yellow]

The ONLY thing I would say....is that by you initiating the e-mail, defending yourself....you put yourself in the "victim" position. You have nothing that needs defending, or explaining, or rationalizin at all. By "defending" yourself, you're sort of setting yourself up (with people who would want to push those buttons). {{{{HUGS}}}}

BTW...the breafast sounds disgusting. :-P That is irrelevant because I'm not eating it! It is certainly healthy! lol! :-D

[Hobbes]

That sounds awesome to me. What does your mom think IS a healthy breakfast?

I wouldn't get a straight answer. I love my mother dearly, but she obsesses about nutrition. Being concerned about nutrition is not a problem, The problem is that she is extremely concerned about very specific nutrients, antioxidants, etc. ANd not all at once, usually it will be one thing and one food item at a time. Very much a 'magic bullet' approach to nutrition. She was very much into goji berries at one point (for a specific type of antioxidant she read about), lately it's all about flax seed (omega 3). It's not that those are bad (on the contrary, we eat the latter :), but just obsessive focus on one thing and the complicated calculations she has to make to figure out if she's eating right.... well, I'm sure

We were having this discussion a couple months ago with her, my brother and nephew. She said "Eating right is so complicated, I need a Ph.D. to eat right." All three of us chimed in "Eating right is actually quite simple" Since we all read "In Defense of Food" ROFL, we said the rules to eating right and healthy are three: Eat whole foods, eat less, eat lots and a variety of plants. We didn't say it was easy, just quite simple.

She apparently hasn't let that sunk in. Im sure my mother would probably think the oatmeal needed flax seed and goji berries and cut the peanut butter and not add any sugar. Of course DD would NOT have eaten that, so how healthy is that?

[Hobbes]

The ONLY thing I would say....is that by you initiating the e-mail, defending yourself....you put yourself in the "victim" position. You have nothing that needs defending, or explaining, or rationalizin at all. By "defending" yourself, you're sort of setting yourself up (with people who would want to push those buttons). {{{{HUGS}}}}

BTW...the breafast sounds disgusting. :-P That is irrelevant because I'm not eating it! It is certainly healthy! lol! :-D

yep. I try but fail. I've been so good about ignoring those comments from her, and tried really hard not to say anything at dinner. Finally had to just to stop her from hounding me on it.

I sent the email my damn button was pushed so much and hard lately, it got stuck. LOL

Shouldn't have, but ah well...

Emma absolutely loves that breakfast. I find it unappetizing to say the least. But hey, it's that or froot loops (though she'll also eat an egg with cheese on a ww bagel and a ww waffle with lowfat cream cheese and only-apple applebutter w/ sliced bananas... she's very particular).

[Hobbes]

Sounds like a deconstructed low fat oatmeal peanut butter muffin (banana replaces fat in muffin recipes) with fruit on the side.

What's the problem?

Is anyone giving you shit about sugar????? That's crazy talk. There's *nothing* wrong with sugar as a condiment. It's when it's being consumed as a food group that there's an issue.

I like that, a deconstructed low fat oatmeal peanut butter muffin :D.

see, that's the problem about obsessing sometimes. My mom decides sugar is bad and so even a tsp is bad. Yet she'll neglect to realize that it's not usually the sugar (or salt) we add to our own food, but that which is processed foods. The froot loops her grandchildren (and we have no problem with that... it's grandma's house... special treat) has 2-3x the sugar we added to that breakfast.

[Gargoyle]

I've only just now been able to get a handle on being ok with my mother's opinions. They are just that, opinions. I'm not interested in fighting with her about them. Frankly, I never did, on the outside, but I'd have these HUGE fights on the inside. I'd seeth and get so pissed off and well, was only hurting myself. Basically, she won because I was miserable. I finally came to a place where I am me again, the me she tried to train out of me, when I was young, with some of the same things I hear you saying you mom is telling you. "Act this way because this is how society would like you to act. Don't bother people, don't make a sound people won't like it, blah blah blah." LOL Yeah I think it's blah blah blah now. I took it to heart for years.

I know I'm not anywhere near like my mom. There are bad days, when I do let what she says, affect me more then I should. If I get pounded with her opinion a few too many times, I have had to stop myself from implementing what ever nonsense thing she told me I should do in my parenting. That is very very rare now as my confidence has skyrocketed in the last year. What has helped it is watching my mom interact with others and understanding, that what she's doing, she's doing because she loves me and my children and she really does think she's doing the best for us. I just know that I can recite every thing that I am that goes against her "rules" for children. Like that kids need to go to school or they won't know how to be social. LOL Um hello, I'm the worst social person the face of the earth I went to public school. In fact, most people scare the hell out of me.

You will never be you mom. You know why? Because you'll remember this feeling and never ever want your child to feel what you're feeling right now. (((((HUGS))))

[macaquinha]

... and I totally reserve the right to be an interfering grandma with my own incorrect and biased opinions on what my children are doing incorrectly.

I knew you were a woman after my own heart! I can't wait to watch that.... :-P

[azul99]

yep. I try but fail. I've been so good about ignoring those comments from her, and tried really hard not to say anything at dinner. Finally had to just to stop her from hounding me on it.

I sent the email my damn button was pushed so much and hard lately, it got stuck. LOL

Shouldn't have, but ah well...

Emma absolutely loves that breakfast. I find it unappetizing to say the least. But hey, it's that or froot loops (though she'll also eat an egg with cheese on a ww bagel and a ww waffle with lowfat cream cheese and only-apple applebutter w/ sliced bananas... she's very particular).

It's hard not to engage, but with people like this it is really important. Otherwise you get into this awful spiral and ... well, you know. LOL

Suggested script:

Mom: "Is that healthy?"
You: Look confused.
Mom: "I mean, that has a lot of fat and you are adding sugar."
You: "Huh. You think? I'll give that some thought."

Move on to another topic.

Wash, rinse, repeat.

Easier said than done, but once you get the hang of it, it becomes second nature.

[Tracy]

It's hard not to engage, but with people like this it is really important. Otherwise you get into this awful spiral and ... well, you know. LOL

Suggested script:

Mom: "Is that healthy?"
You: Look confused.
Mom: "I mean, that has a lot of fat and you are adding sugar."
You: "Huh. You think? I'll give that some thought."

Move on to another topic.

Wash, rinse, repeat.

Easier said than done, but once you get the hang of it, it becomes second nature.

See, maybe everyone I know is just clueless but I can only do that for awhile. Unfortunately though, I have really noticed that doing so seems to actually give them permission to speak to me like that.

People can only treat us the way we allow them too and, in my experiences, if I validate that behavior, by remaining silent or even saying "I'll give that some thought", it seems to send the message that it's ok. Drives me nuts, actually ! *LOL*

I fully recognize that it's something I have to work on. I just really need to find a middle ground between feeling like I allow people to treat me badly by being super non confrontational or then going the opposite direction and engaging with them about something stupid. Frankly, I also get irritated that it seems to only be me who even cares. Why is it me who has to not engage or watch what I say when apparently, everyone around me thinks it's ok to let fly whatever comes into their head, ya know?

And ya, I recently had this come up with a family member so it's fresh in my mind *LOL*

You'd think that by 41 (almost 42) I'd have a little more worked out but....Nope!

[azul99]

See, maybe everyone I know is just clueless but I can only do that for awhile. Unfortunately though, I have really noticed that doing so seems to actually give them permission to speak to me like that.

People can only treat us the way we allow them too and, in my experiences, if I validate that behavior, by remaining silent or even saying "I'll give that some thought", it seems to send the message that it's ok. Drives me nuts, actually ! *LOL*

I fully recognize that it's something I have to work on. I just really need to find a middle ground between feeling like I allow people to treat me badly by being super non confrontational or then going the opposite direction and engaging with them about something stupid. Frankly, I also get irritated that it seems to only be me who even cares. Why is it me who has to not engage or watch what I say when apparently, everyone around me thinks it's ok to let fly whatever comes into their head, ya know?

And ya, I recently had this come up with a family member so it's fresh in my mind *LOL*

You'd think that by 41 (almost 42) I'd have a little more worked out but....Nope!

You can't change the people around you. You can only change your responses to them. (At least, that is what I tell myself.)

My MIL (for example) is super-intrusive and boundary-less. Whatever you tell her, she wants to know more, more more, whether or not it concerns her and whether or not she has been asked to back off. It makes me positively NUTS. She will never, ever change, however. Never. So all I can do, to reduce my own anger and defensiveness, is to change my response to her.

I used to get defensive and frustrated. Now, I give her the bare minimum of information and then try to move onto another topic. It annoys me to give her ANY information (because why is she asking these personal questions to begin with?) but it sure beats the hell out of expending all of the energy I used to expend on getting angry, frustrated etc.

To your point, maybe it does translate, in her mind, to me validating her behavior, I dunno. What matters to me is that in *my* mind, that's not what I'm doing. And if I am successfully keeping her nose out of my stuff, then I'll take that as my victory and move on, YK?

[elizabeth]

You can't change the people around you. You can only change your responses to them. (At least, that is what I tell myself.)

My MIL (for example) is super-intrusive and boundary-less. Whatever you tell her, she wants to know more, more more, whether or not it concerns her and whether or not she has been asked to back off. It makes me positively NUTS. She will never, ever change, however. Never. So all I can do, to reduce my own anger and defensiveness, is to change my response to her.

I used to get defensive and frustrated. Now, I give her the bare minimum of information and then try to move onto another topic. It annoys me to give her ANY information (because why is she asking these personal questions to begin with?) but it sure beats the hell out of expending all of the energy I used to on getting angry, frustrated etc.

To your point, maybe it does translate, in her mind, to me validating her behavior, I dunno. What matters to me is that in *my* mind, that's not what I'm doing. And if I am successfully keeping her nose out of my stuff, then I'll take that as my victory and move on, YK?

I totally get that (and agree).

[Loopy]

yep. I try but fail. I've been so good about ignoring those comments from her, and tried really hard not to say anything at dinner. Finally had to just to stop her from hounding me on it.

I sent the email my damn button was pushed so much and hard lately, it got stuck. LOL

Shouldn't have, but ah well...

Emma absolutely loves that breakfast. I find it unappetizing to say the least. But hey, it's that or froot loops (though she'll also eat an egg with cheese on a ww bagel and a ww waffle with lowfat cream cheese and only-apple applebutter w/ sliced bananas... she's very particular).

With people like that you just have to decide whether sending the email will have a purpose - i.e. to make YOU feel better - because you must accept that the sky is purple to them even it you took a color chart out and showed them it was blue. In the end, did YOU feel better? If so, then kudos and do it again.

[Tracy]

With people like that you just have to decide whether sending the email will have a purpose - i.e. to make YOU feel better - because you must accept that the sky is purple to them even it you took a color chart out and showed them it was blue. In the end, did YOU feel better? If so, then kudos and do it again.

*LOL* I love this. (nt)

[kathy caribe]

You can't change the people around you. You can only change your responses to them. (At least, that is what I tell myself.)

My MIL (for example) is super-intrusive and boundary-less. Whatever you tell her, she wants to know more, more more, whether or not it concerns her and whether or not she has been asked to back off. It makes me positively NUTS. She will never, ever change, however. Never. So all I can do, to reduce my own anger and defensiveness, is to change my response to her.

I used to get defensive and frustrated. Now, I give her the bare minimum of information and then try to move onto another topic. It annoys me to give her ANY information (because why is she asking these personal questions to begin with?) but it sure beats the hell out of expending all of the energy I used to expend on getting angry, frustrated etc.

To your point, maybe it does translate, in her mind, to me validating her behavior, I dunno. What matters to me is that in *my* mind, that's not what I'm doing. And if I am successfully keeping her nose out of my stuff, then I'll take that as my victory and move on, YK?

Ok, call me evil, but the way I used to deal with it was to make nonsensical responses. so, to "do you think that's healthy?" I'd say, "Yes, I think that Mayor Gavin is doing a GREAT job!" She thinks I'm nutz but at least it makes me feel better.

[leannan_si]

We have family members like that. If we deflect or ignore a subject, they bring it up over and over and over again. They just will.not.let.it.go. And there are times when we have stood firm and they still won't let it go. It's maddening to say the least. :banghead:


See, maybe everyone I know is just clueless but I can only do that for awhile. Unfortunately though, I have really noticed that doing so seems to actually give them permission to speak to me like that.

People can only treat us the way we allow them too and, in my experiences, if I validate that behavior, by remaining silent or even saying "I'll give that some thought", it seems to send the message that it's ok. Drives me nuts, actually ! *LOL*

I fully recognize that it's something I have to work on. I just really need to find a middle ground between feeling like I allow people to treat me badly by being super non confrontational or then going the opposite direction and engaging with them about something stupid. Frankly, I also get irritated that it seems to only be me who even cares. Why is it me who has to not engage or watch what I say when apparently, everyone around me thinks it's ok to let fly whatever comes into their head, ya know?

And ya, I recently had this come up with a family member so it's fresh in my mind *LOL*

You'd think that by 41 (almost 42) I'd have a little more worked out but....Nope!

[serialmom]

My DD would have a better morning if she ate. It might help kick her out of her insomnia cycle, but I digress. IMO it's a nutritious, creative breakfast. Life is good.

I agree with Jerzy. In this case, the sugar is a condiment, not a meal in itself. Your mom? I agree with what you said. It wasn't an insult. You worked your own magic. She quieted down. That wasn't meant to be mean. I just think it's hard for parents to let go and let their kids do their own parenting.

In an odd way, the fact that she can call this into question should tell her that life is very good, if she looks at it that way. I mean, look at what she's concerned about. There are so many serious things she - could - be concerned about. If I compare E's breakfast with a box of cereal, I don't see how E's recipe is questionable and boxed cereal is superior. They're breakfast. This totally sums up the differences between my aunt and my mom. Mom thought anything packaged was best, while my aunt wanted us to get creative with food, textures, try new things.

On the noise levels, as sensory challenged as I am, I steady myself and tell myself to enjoy exuberance. I welcome loud and happy because it tells me my kids aren't 1) arguing or 2) depressed. I think what you said, in general, is very true for most kids her age. Again, life is good.

[elizabeth]

Ok, call me evil, but the way I used to deal with it was to make nonsensical responses. so, to "do you think that's healthy?" I'd say, "Yes, I think that Mayor Gavin is doing a GREAT job!" She thinks I'm nutz but at least it makes me feel better.

LOL. I'm going to have to try that. So much more self-entertaining than "pass the bean dip."

[Hobbes]

We have family members like that. If we deflect or ignore a subject, they bring it up over and over and over again. They just will.not.let.it.go. And there are times when we have stood firm and they still won't let it go. It's maddening to say the least. :banghead:

Yeah, I think this is my mother. A pitt bull on whatever she's focused on. That's a good thing (I can have that quality sometimes), but when it comes to this, if I ignore it... she' hound on it (as example, the dinner conversation above. But of course if I give a defense, it's not any better.

so perhaps... then nonsensical answer might just do the trick LOL!

[Storymama]

Yeah, I think this is my mother. A pitt bull on whatever she's focused on. That's a good thing (I can have that quality sometimes), but when it comes to this, if I ignore it... she' hound on it (as example, the dinner conversation above. But of course if I give a defense, it's not any better.

so perhaps... then nonsensical answer might just do the trick LOL!
Maybe, maybe not . . . but you do realize that at the level Jennifer describes and with which you sympathize, it's actually bullying, right? That element in any relationship is at best inappropriate, right down the spectrum to abusive depending (and from things J has described in the past, I would put some of her family's actions in that latter category - not so much your mom, but you know her best.) It really is bullying regardless of the point on the continuum and only you know whether you'd want to tackle to the issue for someone older like that or not. I probably would not in your shoes, but if I did (and I have) - it would be calling the behavior what it was, ignoring the deflective "issue" that was the current pit-bull focus altogether, and making the conversation about why I ought to stay in the company of someone intent on browbeating me in such a bullying, disrespectful fashion. But to go there, means you will follow through on removing yourself from their company, and enforcing that in the future too.

I have chosen to draw my own lines on these sorts of interactions as follows: zero abusive behavior, plus anything my kids witness particularly if it is a person with whom they will have to deal one-on-one too. More than peace-for-peace's sake relationships, I wish to model for my kids a proactive, healthy model for them to follow in their own interactions and relationships. I think self esteem and personal power in relationships is the single biggest skill I want them to leave my home really *owning*, though . . . I know this is not everyone's first priority, and so everyone's lines will be drawn accordingly. Please do consider whether E sees her browbeat you like this, though. At the very least, please debrief her on a level she can understand, why you accept the treatment from Grandma when you would never let a peer (or child) treat you this way, and how you will not ever treat her this way either.

[leannan_si]

Maybe, maybe not . . . but you do realize that at the level Jennifer describes and with which you sympathize, it's actually bullying, right? That element in any relationship is at best inappropriate, right down the spectrum to abusive depending (and from things J has described in the past, I would put some of her family's actions in that latter category - not so much your mom, but you know her best.) It really is bullying regardless of the point on the continuum and only you know whether you'd want to tackle to the issue for someone older like that or not.

My mom I guess I'd come to taking with a grain of salt. And her past actions were so abusive that what she was doing seemed so mild in comparison that I didn't take it for what it was. I haven't talked with her in almost 2 years, but I'll have to face her and our issues eventually...

With the other family members, I always said that they don't respect us, but putting it in the frame of bullying I can see how that's exactly what it is. For example, they have been asking us for a couple of years to go on vacation with them to a hotel and water park resort combo type of place, but they only want to go during the school year. We tell them repeatedly that we won't take the kids out of school, I can't take the time off of work, and we haven't had the money for a trip like that. But they ask us over, and over, and over again. Last year they were literally calling us once a week for approximately a month *after* we'd already said no, saying "No pressure, but we'd really like you to go on this vacation with us". We had a falling out over that and other issues (same type of behavior) and didn't talk to them for a few months, but just recently they asked Dh again. Luckily I think they were too afraid of us returning to no contact so they didn't ask us again after he said no, but they did tease Dh about it and sort of gave him a hard time because we wouldn't go.

Hearing you say it's bullying is exactly right and I can't believe I haven't seen it that way before. Thank you Mandi. Your perspective has really helped.

[BadWolf]

Probably about as awful as my daughter telling me a story about something weird my ex-MIL did, rolling her eyes, and saying to me, "Well, you know how Grandma is." ROFL. Oh yes, dear...all too well. LOL.

[Hobbes]

Maybe, maybe not . . . but you do realize that at the level Jennifer describes and with which you sympathize, it's actually bullying, right? That element in any relationship is at best inappropriate, right down the spectrum to abusive depending (and from things J has described in the past, I would put some of her family's actions in that latter category - not so much your mom, but you know her best.) It really is bullying regardless of the point on the continuum and only you know whether you'd want to tackle to the issue for someone older like that or not. I probably would not in your shoes, but if I did (and I have) - it would be calling the behavior what it was, ignoring the deflective "issue" that was the current pit-bull focus altogether, and making the conversation about why I ought to stay in the company of someone intent on browbeating me in such a bullying, disrespectful fashion. But to go there, means you will follow through on removing yourself from their company, and enforcing that in the future too.

I have chosen to draw my own lines on these sorts of interactions as follows: zero abusive behavior, plus anything my kids witness particularly if it is a person with whom they will have to deal one-on-one too. More than peace-for-peace's sake relationships, I wish to model for my kids a proactive, healthy model for them to follow in their own interactions and relationships. I think self esteem and personal power in relationships is the single biggest skill I want them to leave my home really *owning*, though . . . I know this is not everyone's first priority, and so everyone's lines will be drawn accordingly. Please do consider whether E sees her browbeat you like this, though. At the very least, please debrief her on a level she can understand, why you accept the treatment from Grandma when you would never let a peer (or child) treat you this way, and how you will not ever treat her this way either.

There are times with her behavior, including this one, that I think you are right. She's is bullying. Most of the time she is sweet, thoughtful and fun to be around.

But thinking about this as you say it, it is indeed bullying and disrespectful. For a couple decades my response has be defense (as have my brothers). Last summer she did something so disrespectful and bullying, I told her that was the end of the conversation. Period. We didn't talk for two months. Though I was pained by that, she was hurt and angry that I refused to talk to her about anything except getting together with DD (I will _never_ use my children as weapons, _never_. I used to be one of those weapons. I will not do that to a child or even the grandparent). We eventually talked and I _think_ she got it.

This wasn't that in degree, but it was in kind. She was bullying and disrespecting (especially the dinner conversation). Perhaps it's time to talk to her again.

[Hawthorne]

Maybe, maybe not . . . but you do realize that at the level Jennifer describes and with which you sympathize, it's actually bullying, right? That element in any relationship is at best inappropriate, right down the spectrum to abusive depending (and from things J has described in the past, I would put some of her family's actions in that latter category - not so much your mom, but you know her best.) It really is bullying regardless of the point on the continuum and only you know whether you'd want to tackle to the issue for someone older like that or not. I probably would not in your shoes, but if I did (and I have) - it would be calling the behavior what it was, ignoring the deflective "issue" that was the current pit-bull focus altogether, and making the conversation about why I ought to stay in the company of someone intent on browbeating me in such a bullying, disrespectful fashion. But to go there, means you will follow through on removing yourself from their company, and enforcing that in the future too.

I have chosen to draw my own lines on these sorts of interactions as follows: zero abusive behavior, plus anything my kids witness particularly if it is a person with whom they will have to deal one-on-one too. More than peace-for-peace's sake relationships, I wish to model for my kids a proactive, healthy model for them to follow in their own interactions and relationships. I think self esteem and personal power in relationships is the single biggest skill I want them to leave my home really *owning*, though . . . I know this is not everyone's first priority, and so everyone's lines will be drawn accordingly. Please do consider whether E sees her browbeat you like this, though. At the very least, please debrief her on a level she can understand, why you accept the treatment from Grandma when you would never let a peer (or child) treat you this way, and how you will not ever treat her this way either.

Once again, Mandi- Brilliant. This is why I ended up not going to visit my oldest sister anymore.

[webbeccjo]

There are times with her behavior, including this one, that I think you are right. She's is bullying. Most of the time she is sweet, thoughtful and fun to be around.



My mother is like this as well. What helped diffuse things for us - aside from setting boundaries when her behavior gets too overtly bullying was to address her underlying concerns rather than defend my or the kids behavors.
I would keep reminding myself that some of her concern does stem from the fact that she loves my kids and wants a degree of involvement with them. I'd say things to her like "It means a lot to me that you love dd so much that you are concerned about her health!"
But becasue some of her behaviors were just not healthy, I often have to be firm in setting very concrete boundaries with her." here's what you can say to them ..here's what you can't say to them...."

If their behavior gave her sensory overload I'd try to respond in terms of her sensory issues not my kids behaviors...ie:" I understand that normal kid exuberance is sometimes too much for you mom, I'll try to help the kids remember that you are sensitive to normal kid noises."

and as for the breakfast thing my kids love that sort of peanut butter oatmeal mixture! lol! they've been known to add brown sugar to that as well! they call it raw cookies

[Storymama]

and as for the breakfast thing my kids love that sort of peanut butter oatmeal mixture!
Oh, yeah - I meant to say that Amelia doesn't think they are really Cheerios, unless it's full of PB too LOL! (I think that's a little :gross:, but it does get protein into her seriously hypoglycemic self.) I know she fixes it that way for herself at the Dining hall at college, LOL!